A few months ago I had written about trying to find a church. I realized that I haven't filled in the gaps on where we have ended up. The fact is that we have found a great church family at Gateway Worship Centre. They have welcomed us and helped us feel at home. They aren't perfect, but in all honesty, if they tried to be we wouldn't be there There is no attempt to be something they are not and we don't have to be more than we are. They love Jesus and care about the town they live in. I have grown tired of congregations that try to present as having it all together; whether that means on a personal level or a institutional level.
Gateway is led by the Spirit. I feel each Sunday that the service could go anywhere if the Spirit leads. It is an amazing thing to hear a senior gentleman pray out with great emotion, not on cue or as part of the script, but because he is moved. To have the band whisper to the worship leader, "you have to play that song you wrote" or the pastor cry out in emotion for the message he has. I haven't experienced these things before, not in a genuine way.
I've watched a dear old senior walk to the front to serve communion, one pant leg half tucked into his boot. I think many churches wouldn't let this type of fellow near the front with the suits...but there he was serving with a smile. And each week he greets me and asks how the camp is doing and how we are doing.
They are so friendly. I feel like we have gained friends, parents and grandparents in the people that are there.
Today they threw a shower for our family on the arrival of Greyson. So many thoughtful gifts from people that are just getting to know us, but have adopted us as part of their community. One older lady crocheted a whole blanket for him.... the type of gifts that grandmas give to grandchildren and it was given to our new son.
I'm not setting out to sell anyone on this church. But I have to say that people are coming and it's not because they have the best program or the coolest technology or a slick whatever..... the love God and the love people. Sure there are rough edges but I am becoming more and more convinced that this is what Christianity looks like; a group of imperfect people loving one another, because Jesus said to love one another. And then together joining to love God and worship him in the best ways that know how.
On the off chance that you live in the Gravenhurst area and are looking for a church that will offer you love no matter what you state of being.... come and check out Gateway. End of endorsement
Showing posts with label Church. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Church. Show all posts
28 March 2010
28 October 2009
The search for The Church
One thing that has not really happend yet since moving to Torrance to take the job at Camp Crossroads is for Brea and I to find a church body to be a part of. We really want to be a part of a community, to find a people that want to seek Jesus on a daily basis and also seek to be Jesus to live close by. A church body that is growing spiritually and is looking to make a difference (if not friends) in the community.
In the spring we went to the litle presbyterian church down the road. The people there were very freindly and welcoming. The worship service was pretty slow and mostly hyms out of the book, many at which even those in the pews didn't seem to know. The teaching was good, but notably in sync with a common passage in the denonmination and thus not exactly as passionate as something that was brough personally from the pastor. One of the main reasons that we had started with the church in town is that we want to tap into this community we live in and get to know people. On thing about the church in Torrance, they weren't doing much to get to know their neighbours. The pastor and his wife run a great afterschool program, but it's not something the community is interested in. In the end we really felt it was right to look for other places.
The summer was crazy busy at camp and it wasn't untill fall that we had a few chancs to start looking at other places. One church that often came up in searches and conversations was Glennwood Chapel. It was a day in September that I went on my own, Teen Challenge was there and it was a really great service. (Since then we have started supporting them a little bit). Brea was back for a few services on weekends that I couldn't and was excited by pastor Reg's preaching on what was the vision for the community that the church was in. So a few weeks ago Brea and I finally had an oportunity to go together and were really looking forward to it. It started off well enough - actually Life 100.3 was there which was cool, hadn't seen Scott Jackson, the GM in a few years - but then pastor Reg got up for his "sermon" I have put it in quotations because it really wasn't a sermon at all. Really just a presentation of what direction Glennwood needed to move in to become a bigger church. It was just that, how to go from being a small church, to a medium church, to a large church. I really started feeling sick. I couldn't believe that someone would actually take the time to lay out a plan that was so stuck on numbers of people attending on a Sunday morning. He used one slide that in esseces said a small church moves from being "Relationship Driven" to "Program Driven" - I wanted to walk out. He also had slides that said rediculous things like the pastor needs to move from "caring for people" to being and "administratior" So very quickly I was feeling like Glennwood is not the right place for us.
We are looking at other places and praying that God would give us a clue about what is the right place to be.
So more on the progression later. Would you go to a church that activly wants to move to a program bias?
We just want to be a part of a group of people that want to change their community and be changed by the Spirit.... not fill seats and build programs that people will hopefully want to come to
In the spring we went to the litle presbyterian church down the road. The people there were very freindly and welcoming. The worship service was pretty slow and mostly hyms out of the book, many at which even those in the pews didn't seem to know. The teaching was good, but notably in sync with a common passage in the denonmination and thus not exactly as passionate as something that was brough personally from the pastor. One of the main reasons that we had started with the church in town is that we want to tap into this community we live in and get to know people. On thing about the church in Torrance, they weren't doing much to get to know their neighbours. The pastor and his wife run a great afterschool program, but it's not something the community is interested in. In the end we really felt it was right to look for other places.
The summer was crazy busy at camp and it wasn't untill fall that we had a few chancs to start looking at other places. One church that often came up in searches and conversations was Glennwood Chapel. It was a day in September that I went on my own, Teen Challenge was there and it was a really great service. (Since then we have started supporting them a little bit). Brea was back for a few services on weekends that I couldn't and was excited by pastor Reg's preaching on what was the vision for the community that the church was in. So a few weeks ago Brea and I finally had an oportunity to go together and were really looking forward to it. It started off well enough - actually Life 100.3 was there which was cool, hadn't seen Scott Jackson, the GM in a few years - but then pastor Reg got up for his "sermon" I have put it in quotations because it really wasn't a sermon at all. Really just a presentation of what direction Glennwood needed to move in to become a bigger church. It was just that, how to go from being a small church, to a medium church, to a large church. I really started feeling sick. I couldn't believe that someone would actually take the time to lay out a plan that was so stuck on numbers of people attending on a Sunday morning. He used one slide that in esseces said a small church moves from being "Relationship Driven" to "Program Driven" - I wanted to walk out. He also had slides that said rediculous things like the pastor needs to move from "caring for people" to being and "administratior" So very quickly I was feeling like Glennwood is not the right place for us.
We are looking at other places and praying that God would give us a clue about what is the right place to be.
So more on the progression later. Would you go to a church that activly wants to move to a program bias?
We just want to be a part of a group of people that want to change their community and be changed by the Spirit.... not fill seats and build programs that people will hopefully want to come to
19 August 2009
A step in the right direction?
Over at Church Marketing Sucks they have a post about a church that is taking a stand against abortion.
One Atlanta church has a bold challenge to anyone considering abortion: "Peachtree Presbyterian Church will care for any newborn baby you bring to this church."I think it's great to know that a church is taking this kind of stand. I have always hated the "stop abortion" stance with out any real provision for what we will do with the unwanted babies. I hope the move is of right motivations and not a publicity stunt of some degree. But, asuming the have the right intentions it is interesting to hear of one church moving to take care of the unwanted babies.
So says Pastor Vic Pentz in a recent sermon. The church is partnering with the adoption agency Bethany Christian Services to make this happen and to start the education process for their congregation. Adoption is never simple and easy, but I love this bold action instead of the usual rhetoric around abortion.
14 November 2008
UrbanEx
My friends Em and Alan over at UrbanEx have just launched the new site.
I can't speak highly enough of them or the vision they have. If you are involved with youth that want to stretch their horizon, or want to have your own life challenged the site is worth checking out.
From the new site... UrbanEx is:
I can't speak highly enough of them or the vision they have. If you are involved with youth that want to stretch their horizon, or want to have your own life challenged the site is worth checking out.
From the new site... UrbanEx is:
..an active-advocacy organization for justice and dignity for all mankind that educates, empowers, enables, and mobilizes others in practical and effective advocacy that will actively meet the needs of any urban community by addressing the relief of poverty, awareness and appreciation of cultural and lifestyle differences, and our individual and corporate responsibilities to our communities through intentional actions with measured results that benefit individuals as well as the entire urban community.
In different ways Em and Alan have both influenced the way I think. I wish them nothing but the best in their on going ministry. And I hope the stories just grow and grow and grow
20 October 2008
iCommunity
I think it is great thoughts from a website that by nature promotes the use of tools (technology) in communication.
If ever there was a buzzword for the past several years that the church--myself included--has been in love with, it would be the word "community." And rightly so because community is so desperately lacking these days. People are lonely and isolated. Today, 1 out of every 4 households in the U.S. has just one person living there. In 1950, it was 1 out of every 10. So while we may be more connected than any other generation, we're more detached than ever before.
Sure, Facebook an the like have the illusion of Community - their not all bad either, but it is great to see balanced coverage of the effects on our communities, one that is not "EVIL" and one that is not adopt everything because it is there.
Thoughts on the Meeting House
The Gig had a farewell for us two weeks ago, because we were supposed to be living and working in Stratford by now. As we had said all our goodbyes we felt a little strange going there on Sunday morning and also thought it would be a great chance to check out another church community in Kitchener. So we decided to check out The Meeting House. I thought maybe I would post on my thoughts about my first time being a part of their Sunday morning gathering. First I have to say is was good to see so many familiar faces - looking over the staff list there are a lot of friends from the past (even an old roommate) - I think that they are all striving to do good work so I hope my criticism is not taken as an attack on what they are doing, more this is my analysis of how I think they are heading in the wrong direction.
First, the things that thought were good. The elements were all very good - worship music and presentation. It's all very coordinated and smooth. Bruxy Cavey was on his usual game as an excellent laid back teacher. I can see why people come out, the product is very good.
So what is my problem? well if you read my last post or have been following my thoughts on technology and the church you would know that I'm trying to look at the bigger issues than just what happen on the Sunday morning. One of the problems with the video venue is what it is saying (this is a medium is the message type thing) about who can speak to the church. Bruxy is an amazing speaker - no contest. But the meeting house just keeps adding sites. When you look at everything else, the meeting house is just about the same as many other churches, except they all watch the big screen to see a common message. So if you extrapolate the vision or goal - eventually you would have a Meeting house in every city or town. Or maybe the end expansion would (or should) be that every church is a video extension of Bruxy's teaching. I'm not saying the Bruxy shouldn't teach a lot of poeple, but what does it say when we enforce a message that only one voice is good enough to teach? Is there no person in all of the Golden Horeshoe or Western Ontario (and coming to Ottawa) that is a good enough speaker to teach the public? I think people would deny this as a statement, but you have to see this is what the "medium" is sending as a message.
What if Bruxy isn't the best teacher - what if say Rob Bell is a better speaker? The Meeting House had defined its existence on transmitting the best teacher they can find. Maybe they would have better results if someone else what the teacher and we could double the churches because someone like Rob Bell would draw more people (sort of sound like celebrity doesn't it?) do the people that come out care about who as long as it is deemed good? The motion is towards all sites digesting whatever come on the screen as truth. Whatever the Great OZ says is truth. There is the potential for the thing to get so big that only those at the top really have any control over what is said or preached. Right now, I assume there are good checks and balances in place, but how big does it get to be out of control? What if no one thinks it is out of control?
I'm not saying that the Meeting House has no checks and balances. I'm not saying that the teaching is wrong, all I'm saying is that they seem to think that growth by more sites is unlimitedly good (we cheered a new satellite location) But is this the type of growth that is good for the church? That we all tune in for directions? I think this is what the Protestant reformation was all about. Rome told people what their religion was about and they did not have a voice. I think the Meeting House model moves the average person in community farther away from having a voice or being a part of conversation.
I believe more and more in raising up new leaders, can you do this in a model where only the very best is heard? Is there room for learning and training - especially if you expand the method to it's extreme?
I hope that the Meeting House is making a difference in the community. I hope lives are change and Jesus is the centre. I also hope it doesn't ever go where I think it could.
First, the things that thought were good. The elements were all very good - worship music and presentation. It's all very coordinated and smooth. Bruxy Cavey was on his usual game as an excellent laid back teacher. I can see why people come out, the product is very good.
So what is my problem? well if you read my last post or have been following my thoughts on technology and the church you would know that I'm trying to look at the bigger issues than just what happen on the Sunday morning. One of the problems with the video venue is what it is saying (this is a medium is the message type thing) about who can speak to the church. Bruxy is an amazing speaker - no contest. But the meeting house just keeps adding sites. When you look at everything else, the meeting house is just about the same as many other churches, except they all watch the big screen to see a common message. So if you extrapolate the vision or goal - eventually you would have a Meeting house in every city or town. Or maybe the end expansion would (or should) be that every church is a video extension of Bruxy's teaching. I'm not saying the Bruxy shouldn't teach a lot of poeple, but what does it say when we enforce a message that only one voice is good enough to teach? Is there no person in all of the Golden Horeshoe or Western Ontario (and coming to Ottawa) that is a good enough speaker to teach the public? I think people would deny this as a statement, but you have to see this is what the "medium" is sending as a message.
What if Bruxy isn't the best teacher - what if say Rob Bell is a better speaker? The Meeting House had defined its existence on transmitting the best teacher they can find. Maybe they would have better results if someone else what the teacher and we could double the churches because someone like Rob Bell would draw more people (sort of sound like celebrity doesn't it?) do the people that come out care about who as long as it is deemed good? The motion is towards all sites digesting whatever come on the screen as truth. Whatever the Great OZ says is truth. There is the potential for the thing to get so big that only those at the top really have any control over what is said or preached. Right now, I assume there are good checks and balances in place, but how big does it get to be out of control? What if no one thinks it is out of control?
I'm not saying that the Meeting House has no checks and balances. I'm not saying that the teaching is wrong, all I'm saying is that they seem to think that growth by more sites is unlimitedly good (we cheered a new satellite location) But is this the type of growth that is good for the church? That we all tune in for directions? I think this is what the Protestant reformation was all about. Rome told people what their religion was about and they did not have a voice. I think the Meeting House model moves the average person in community farther away from having a voice or being a part of conversation.
I believe more and more in raising up new leaders, can you do this in a model where only the very best is heard? Is there room for learning and training - especially if you expand the method to it's extreme?
I hope that the Meeting House is making a difference in the community. I hope lives are change and Jesus is the centre. I also hope it doesn't ever go where I think it could.
16 October 2008
Mostly a plug for Shane Hipps
I have been doing a lot of research on the effects of technology on culture (both church and everyday regular life) I happened across an article in Slate about video venues and mega churches and was happily surprised to find that Shane Hipps was quoted:
I want to write more on the things that I am learning and thinking, but they will have to wait - check out the article in the meantime.
Using video goes against a critical tenet of Protestant faith: the priesthood of all believers. Instead of a real experience, it offers a mediated one that inherently puts the pastor in a position of greater power over the masses. "It's actually undermining their theology,"in his book Shane has written about the effects of video - not necessarily the separate venue site, but certainly it pertains. The above statement is pretty strong, but I think it needs to be. While I have been expanding my thoughts on media through other authors (Postman, McLuhan etc.) I strongly recommend Shane Hipps as a place to start to become aware of the influence of media on our culture. (I think I have to steal my book back from Rob)
I want to write more on the things that I am learning and thinking, but they will have to wait - check out the article in the meantime.
1 October 2008
More stuff on "stuff"
The coolest thing I heard today was while reading, “The Tangible Kingdom.“
“We have to remember that the ancient faith communities that set a course to change the world did so without church programs, without paid staff, without websites, and without brochures, blogs or buildings. They were lean! The point of going without all the stuff is simple but profound. When you don’t have all the “stuff,” you’re left with a lot of time to stpend[sic] with people.”
I liked that quote, I think that is very in tune with how I feel lately, but the statement does seem to indicate that everything we do is bad. Frank Viola (and others) would certainly agree that we need to return to a first century way of doing things... but then we admit that we don't mind having some technology to work with. I don't think we want to return to the days before the printing press, which the ancient faiths did not have their own personal bibles for study. I doubt the author above was including bible studying as "stuff" that get in the way.
I agree our "stuff" does get in the way at times - but it is more than a soundbite to agree on what "stuff" is good and what is bad.
27 August 2008
With the right marketing anyone can be smart.
I sometimes marvel at how companies can spin things to make their products seem better than everything else - when usually most of their competitors product works equally well. Yes, I'm aware that is the most basic priciple of marketing, but sometimes the end result is just goofy.
I the world of sound system there are a lot of great speaker, amp and processing companies - not matter what you read, there is no one company that will sound good no matter what. Each system requires a talented designer to choose the right componets.
So that being said here is a quote that I read.
First - I'll let you in on a trade secret...every Audio guy that walks into any room will analyze the system. My wife still cringes when I'm critiquing the audio system during a wedding or at any event we are visiting.... so Mr. Chris Gille is no different. What is different is the craziness that the system at Willow Creek is beyond analysis, that in that room, with that system - you just hear the sound.
That is like saying my car runs so smoothly that when I get in I just zoom down the road forgetting I am in a car - while everyone else in the world is aware they are in a car.
OR My forest is so great - I don't even notice it has trees.
Sure he doesn't notice the system ANY MORE. But this is an add using Willow Creek to sell line arrays to churches that would be better off using traditional speakers (my own oppinion).... but if the Mecca of Willow says do it, the clones will follow (ok, that is a different rant)
The reality is every company markets like this to some extent...this one jumped out at me.
I the world of sound system there are a lot of great speaker, amp and processing companies - not matter what you read, there is no one company that will sound good no matter what. Each system requires a talented designer to choose the right componets.
So that being said here is a quote that I read.
"I've been in a couple of hundred rooms, and, to me, this is the best-sounding system in the best-sounding room I've ever been in. In so many other rooms, the first thing I would notice as a sound engineer is the system. But here, the first thing I hear when I walk in is the band jamming, the vocalist singing, or a pastor whispering into a mic. Ever musician is communicating directly to me and every word is crystal clear"
- Chris Gille, Audio Department Head
Willow Creek Community Church
Willow Creek Community Church
First - I'll let you in on a trade secret...every Audio guy that walks into any room will analyze the system. My wife still cringes when I'm critiquing the audio system during a wedding or at any event we are visiting.... so Mr. Chris Gille is no different. What is different is the craziness that the system at Willow Creek is beyond analysis, that in that room, with that system - you just hear the sound.
That is like saying my car runs so smoothly that when I get in I just zoom down the road forgetting I am in a car - while everyone else in the world is aware they are in a car.
OR My forest is so great - I don't even notice it has trees.
Sure he doesn't notice the system ANY MORE. But this is an add using Willow Creek to sell line arrays to churches that would be better off using traditional speakers (my own oppinion).... but if the Mecca of Willow says do it, the clones will follow (ok, that is a different rant)
The reality is every company markets like this to some extent...this one jumped out at me.
18 August 2008
Church or Football?
I got started reading Good Magazine because of the name similarity...but they do have some really interesting stuff...and every so often something really king of fun
Just as a side note, I'm not really a fan or mega churches or football.
Every Sunday during football season, rabid fans gather to root for their team. That same day, people are going to church to pray. This is a comparison between attendance at megachurches and attendance at football games in the five states with the largest megachurch attendance.
View Section 3, Pew 16
Just as a side note, I'm not really a fan or mega churches or football.
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